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File 153607438389.png - (696.28KB , 1187x1064 , eva 11 1.png )
21198 No. 21198 edit
I'm not great with names for games.

This game takes place on Rokkenjima during the 5th of October, the second day of the Family conference. The day before, a letter arrived detailing Beatrice's claim everything the Ushiromiya own.

The letter was sent by Kinzo
Kinzo is alive and Shannon and Kanon are two different people
This makes 18 people on the island at games beginning, before any deaths take place
At the beginning of the story, there are 5 Master Keys. Furthermore in the Servants room one key for each room in the house exists. Except Family Member's bedrooms, who keep their Bedroom Key on their person.
The definition of Master key is; A key which can open every single room on Rokkenjima except Kinzo's study
There are two keys to Kinzo's Study, Genji has one on his person. Kinzo has the other on his person.

Knox's Decalogue doesn't strictly apply to this game. Although despite this.

This game fairly easy to solve

So are you ready to play? It wouldn't take more than even an mediocre detective to kill me here.

The first twilight.

Gohda, Kumasawa, Genji, Shannon, Kanon and Nanjo were found dead by Battler alone in the VIP room
Kumasawa, Genji, Shannon and Kanon were found with circular wounds in their forehead. Nanjo and Gohda had similar wounds on their stomach
The room was a perfect closed room! After the door was locked, no one left and no one entered until Battler broke down the door!
Battler recovered all 5 master keys from the room. Upon finding them he immediately ate one leaving 4 master keys. The key to the VIP room was also locked inside the room
At the time the bodies were discovered, everyone else on the island was within the dining hall

Let's start simple

Last edited at 18/09/04(Tue)16:47:03
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>> No. 21199 edit
File 137929124424.png - (1.05MB , 1366x768 , ozaki_88.png )
21199
>>21198
>he immediately ate one
Well clearly, The keys and people in this game are all part of some complicated edible dish made by Gohda. No murders or anything just a nice family dinner game.

But more seriously, The victims were shot from outside of the room. In which case, The victims locked the room themselves.

Last edited at 18/09/04(Tue)09:12:51
>> No. 21200 edit
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21200
>>21198

Simple really is best.

Everyone was locked in from within, then there was a shootout at the VIP Corral. Nanjo vs. Gohda, if I had to offer a guess, due to their different wounds. The others were caught in the crossfire. They then perished from their gut shots.

Oh, and Battler ate a key because he is strange.
>> No. 21201 edit
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21201
>>21199
The key was inedible, defined as "not fit to be eaten" or not food. Despite this, Battler ate it anyway.

Imagine the keys and keyholes smaller if that stretches suspension of disbelief. It makes no difference.

The room is a perfect closed room. Nothing outside of the room killed them

As for your second blue. I cannot refute that. The room was locked by one of the victims

>>21200
Neither Nanjo or Gohda caused the death of anyone in the room

But as for the accusation Battler is strange? Hehehe... I cannot refute this. The accusation stands.

Fairly intuitive opening moves. You'll have this one solved in no time.
>> No. 21202 edit
Ah shit, actually Kinzo was in his study at the time of the murders and never left it. He didn't kill any of the servants

Sorry, since he's usually dead I forgot about him.
>> No. 21204 edit
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21204
>>21198
Sheesh, Battler must be terminally stupid. Either that, or he is deliberately concealing evidence...

My hypothesis: Genji killed the other 5, then commited suicide. Probably acting as "furniture" on Kinzo's behalf.
>> No. 21205 edit
File 153609517481.png - (695.80KB , 1187x1064 , eva 12 1.png )
21205
>>21204

Aha, you're very close. Although...

Genji did not kill Shannon, Kanon or Kumasawa
Battler found no weapon at the scene of the crime

Maybe he was too busy eating keys to look...

You've found your culprit, so I'd be happy to move onto the next twilight once your blue accounts for Shannon, Kanon and Kumasawa's death
Although I guess it's always possible Genji murdered Gohda and Nanjo with magic... Ahaha
>> No. 21206 edit
File 153261805541.png - (184.07KB , 500x600 , But_b23_komaru2.png )
21206
>>21205
Hmmm...

Shannon, Kanon and Kumasawa were not killed by Genji but commited suicide along with him. They all used the same gun, one after the other. Last one to die positioned themselves so the gun would recoil and fall somewhere it wouldn't be found.
>> No. 21207 edit
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21207
>>21205

Could you please give a red definition of "weapon"?
>> No. 21208 edit
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21208
>>21206
Hehehe, Well done! I won't refute any of this. For the first twilight, I resign.

Now that we're all warmed up, shall we move onto the second.

After discovering the bodies Battler comes down and informs everyone of the situation, excluding Kinzo who is still in his study
Natsuhi immediately leaves the dining hall in a panic. Krauss follows after her. Maria begins to laugh like a freak and creep everyone out. Rosa slaps her across the face and drags her out the dining hall. Shortly after Eva also excuses herself and leaves the dining hall.
a long time passes. Hideyoshi says he's going to find Eva. A short while later Eva returns with Maria informing everyone that Hideyoshi is dead.
Eva leads everyone to the parlour. Battler opens the door. Upon seeing the sight of blood, Battler attempts to eat a Master Key, chips a tooth and runs into an attached bathroom spitting blood into the sink. He then emerges back into the parlour to find everyone crowded round the corpse of Hideyoshi with a stake of purgatory embedded in his chest

How do you propose to solve this one? Hehehe, this is certainly a little trickier than the last one.

Some further truths.
There are now three master keys
It was at the time of Hideyoshi's death Battler first saw the snow now blanketing the island
>> No. 21209 edit
>>21207

I think I know where you're going with this. Perhaps I should elaborate.

Battler found no weapon capable of causing the wounds he saw
As previously deduced by dionysios the weapon used was a gun

Most definitions of weapon are subjective, and the loosest could include practically any object. It's for this reason I decline to clearly define a weapon, but will provide this truth to elaborate on the intended meaning of the red.
>> No. 21210 edit
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21210
>>21209

In that case how about this? The remains of a gun were found. However, since it is no longer functional, it is incapable of causing such wounds and therefore no longer falls under the provided definition.
>> No. 21211 edit
File 153610007193.png - (701.00KB , 1187x1064 , eva 5 1.png )
21211
>>21210
No remains of a gun were found.

Aaah such a simple batch of deaths, and yet it seems my magic has made the weapon disappear into thin air. Hehehe. This is a trick you definitely should know.
>> No. 21212 edit
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21212
>>21211

D-did a corpse fall on it?
>> No. 21213 edit
>>21212
No.
>> No. 21214 edit
File 146584610819.png - (117.84KB , 392x493 , 12.png )
21214
May the definition of a perfect closed room be provided? Were all the windows locked?
>> No. 21215 edit
>>21214

A perfect closed room consists as follows: Once the door was locked. No one and Nothing could enter or exit the room whilst it was locked and this is true for all other points of entry. This of course excludes breaking down the door, which can never be reversed once done. If windows exist, they are locked from the inside. Nothing within the room can be activated remotely from outside of the room. It is a room which is truly locked and not merely made to appear locked before the murders were discovered.

Is that a satisfactory definition?

Last edited at 18/09/04(Tue)16:20:33
>> No. 21216 edit
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21216
>>21215

Indeed it is, thank you. Gun + string + weight + furniture of choice? (minus the dead ones)
>> No. 21217 edit
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21217
>>21216

Very clever!

Genji attached a weight to the gun by a string, after he fired the weight pulled the gun out of sight behind a dresser.

With this the first twilight, and the first set of deaths are completely solved. Well done.

Last edited at 18/09/04(Tue)16:41:40
>> No. 21218 edit
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21218
>>21217

Regarding Hideyoshi, it was a perfect closed room too, right? Just making sure since you have not mentioned it. In red.
>> No. 21219 edit
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21219
>>21218

Before Hideyoshi's body was discovered by Battler, he was sealed in a perfect closed room
though no keys were found in the room.

So someone in possession of a key can enter and exit a perfect closed room at will, as long as they possess that key.

Multiple keys could have opened that door... Who is the culprit I wonder?

I bet it's a witch

Last edited at 18/09/04(Tue)17:15:38
>> No. 21220 edit
File 14000909738.png - (1.01MB , 1366x768 , ozaki_59.png )
21220
>>21208
I take it Battler finished eating the key despite chipping his tooth considering there are only three in red.

Since Battler left the room without checking the body Hideyoshi was killed after the room was opened.
>> No. 21221 edit
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21221
>>21220
Hideyoshi died before the room was opened.

A very predictable opening move... It helps to force your opponent into being predictable. It makes the whole situation seem ever so much more... intimidating.
>> No. 21222 edit
File 139849127112.png - (558.55KB , 1366x768 , ozaki_58.png )
21222
>>21221
It's a classic after all. Anyway, seems odd that Eva and Maria knew he was dead. Maybe they looked through the windows.

Considering the number of keys, Since the parlor key wasn't found, it was simply used to lock the door. Although in that case I wouldn't be surprised if it was found locked in a different room later.
>> No. 21223 edit
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21223
>>21222
Hmm, I cannot refute this.
The parlor key was used to lock the door
>> No. 21224 edit
File 137739767594.png - (1.12MB , 1366x768 , ozaki_26.png )
21224
>>21223
The servants are all dead so I suppose anyone could take the key from the servant room and kill them. Natsuhi and Krauss know more about the mansion but Eva knew Hideyoshi was dead and left it at that so let's say Eva did it. Killed him with a knife or gun since there was blood.
>> No. 21225 edit
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21225
>>21224

Heh, I like it. Though there is perhaps one issue.

Eva did not murder Hideyoshi!
Nor did Eva lock the parlour door
>> No. 21226 edit
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21226
>>21225

Can you confirm/deny Ozaki's theory from earlier? There were footprints in the snow outside parlor windows, which would explain how Eva knew about Hideyoshi's death. If not this then the door was locked after Eva discovered Hideyoshi's body
>> No. 21227 edit
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21227
>>21225
That is a big issue.

There are a few others to choose from... I don't suppose Hideyoshi also committed suicide. They got into a fight and got "torn apart" figuratively and Hideyoshi couldn't handle it.
>> No. 21228 edit
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21228
>>21226

Oh, is this blue being used to make an accusation of innocence? Heh, I see you know how to push a point and think backwards.

No one looked out the window. No one saw any footprints... But I guess you won't be satisfied without some red?

There were no footprints leading towards, or away from the parlour window

As for the second blue... I can refuse... but that'd basically be as good as admitting it.

Eva saw Hideyoshi die. With her own two eyes, happening in the same room as her

What she saw was the witch Eva-Beatrice removing useless dead weight from her life, so she can soar to her rightful place as the Ushiromiya family head! I summoned the Furniture Stake of purgatory and ordered Hideyoshi's death!

Eva was heartbroken. But sacrifices must be made. Hehehe.
>> No. 21229 edit
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21229
>>21227

Hideyoshi did not commit suicide! His killer was right infront of him!
>> No. 21230 edit
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21230
>>21229

Was it perhaps Eva's personality Eva-Beatrice that killed him? (Totally different from Evatrice the Witch)

Last edited at 18/09/04(Tue)18:46:04
>> No. 21231 edit
>>21230
Eva only has one personality
In this gameboard, EVERYONE only has one personality.

You can expect no tricks like that in this game.
>> No. 21232 edit
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21232
Haaaa? Eva saw Hideyoshi get murdered in front of her yet didn't tell the others who it was??? Was the culprit wearing a mask or something? Or is Eva in on it?

Let's see. Natsuhi, Krauss, Rosa, Maria and Eva left the dining hall before Hideyoshi, and only Maria and Eva came back, after he was murdered.

Continuing Ozaki-san's train of thought, a simple explanation would be that Hideyoshi found Eva as he had set out to do, got into a fight with her and was accidentally killed. Thus, Eva did not 'murder' him.

The door was locked by Natsuhi, who had taken the key from the servants' room. I imagine her taking the keys to many rooms for safety reasons, now that the servants are all dead. Or maybe she plans to kill someone too.
>> No. 21233 edit
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21233
>>21232

Hideyoshi and Eva did indeed have an argument which lead to Hideyoshi dying in an accident!

Legally manslaughter, but manslaughter of this type is just a type of accident.

Although Natsuhi didn't lock the door.
>> No. 21234 edit
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21234
>>21233

Thus, the two who are close were torn apart. I wonder what kind of argument it was, to get that heated that quickly.

As for the door and stake, I find it hard to do anything more than guess. Where was everyone else when Eva and Maria went back to the dining hall? Is Kinzo still in his study?
>> No. 21235 edit
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21235
>>21234
Kinzo is still in his study

At this point it's probably best to move on.

After the discovery of Hideyoshi's corpse, Battler looks out the window and sees a set of footprints in the snow seemingly leading away from the Mansion's front door. Eva, Rudolf, Kyrie, Maria, Jessica, George and Battler follow the footprints until they see a lone tree, with a circle of snowless ground underneath it. Rosa's corpse is lying in the snow by the tree with a stake of purgatory embedded in her forehead! The footprints lead to her corpse.
Battler anxiously insists they don't go close. The group makes a circle around the tree and confirms no footprints leading the way, and see nobody hiding in the tree.
There is no one hiding in the tree.


Poor Rosa. She didn't believe in the ascension of the Golden Witch, and she paid the price.
>> No. 21238 edit
File 153619633934.png - (1.01MB , 1366x768 , ozaki_21.png )
21238
>>21235
Hmm, well I suppose the old walking trick is worth a shot.

The culprit walked backwards to create footprints to lead to the tree. This could have either been them walking backwards on already made footprints, or making fresh ones after the snow had fell if they were at the tree at the time. Rosa was either carried there or walked herself which may or may not mean the footprints were originally hers.

As for the how She was shot since getting a stake into the head would have been tough otherwise.
>> No. 21239 edit
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21239
>>21238

Yes and Yes.

The culprit walked backwards through the snow back to the mansion after shooting Rosa with a gun
>> No. 21240 edit
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21240
>>21239
In which case since Eva and Hideyoshi were occupied and the snow only started falling during his death they likely aren't the culprits. If she were shot Maria isn't impossible but unlikely, so Natsuhi or Krauss killed Rosa.
>> No. 21242 edit
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21242
>>21240

Ahahaha!

After discovering Rosa's body, Battler's group finally decide to inform Kinzo
Before heading up stairs, Battler gives one of his Master Keys to George and one to Rudolf
On the way to Kinzo's study, Battler's group find the dead body of Krauss slumped on the floor in front of Natsuhi's door.
George opens the door with a master key, and directly on the other side of the door, Natsuhi is slumped against the floor, dead.
Battler notices a broken window in Natsuhi's room. The wind is clearly blowing into the room. He also notices that the bodies seem to have been dead for quite some time. Several hours at least. He also notes Natsuhi's door key on the floor near her body.

Neither Natsuhi or Krauss could have killed Rosa! because they're both DEAD! hAAAhahahaa!

Last edited at 18/09/07(Fri)10:15:13
>> No. 21244 edit
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21244
Objection!!! Battler has no medical knowledge!

Your red only states that the corpses "seem" dead for hours, not that they indeed are. Battler's opinion on the matter doesn't mean anything. He could easily be entirely mistaken!
>> No. 21245 edit
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21245
>>21244

True enough, and a good place to start. But this time

Battler was right. Natsuhi and Krauss have been dead for hours
>> No. 21246 edit
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21246
>>21245

Hehe, you've just dug your grave, witch!

If Krauss and Natsuhi had only died recently, then this would almost be checkmate in your favor. Excluding Kinzo and the dead, all the others have stayed together since Battler left the dining hall. Except that time the idiot chipped his tooth on a key, of course.

But now! Now it is perfectly clear that they were killed while most of the adults were missing simultaneously. In other words, Eva and Rosa have no alibi for the murders of Krauss and Natsuhi!


Here's my three-fold attack! I propose Eva did it! She killed Krauss and Natsuhi, and broke the window so she could throw the key in from the outside!

After that, she killed Rosa and returned to the mansion the way Ozaki-san reasoned.

Back in the mansion she was approached by Hideyoshi. He realized what she was doing and tried to talk her out of it. They got into a scuffle and, as we know, that lead to Hideyoshi dying in an accident. The parlor door was locked by Maria.


You have shown us the murders all backwards! You lead us to believe a false sequence of events! But no more! Your tricks won't defeat us, delusions of a greedy woman! You are not the Golden Witch! You are just the human, Ushiromiya Evaaaaaaaaa!!!
>> No. 21247 edit
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21247
>>21246

Ugh! Have I been seen through so easily?

Hmph.

The Parlour door was locked by Maria
Eva murdered Rosa


But I'm not finished yet!

Eva didn't kill Krauss or Natsuhi!
The key was not thrown through the broken window
>> No. 21248 edit
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21248
>>21247

Mmm, only a half win. But I'm not finished either! I had already planned this next move!

Krauss and Natsuhi couldn't have killed Rosa but Rosa could have killed Krauss and Natsuhi! Krauss was murdered outside Natsuhi's room, but Natsuhi managed to barricade herself inside. Rosa went outside and shot Natsuhi through the window!

Last edited at 18/09/07(Fri)17:27:09
>> No. 21249 edit
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21249
>>21248

Hahaha! Not so confident now? This could perhaps be my most dastardly move so far. Are you ready to play, Dionysios!??

Rosa did not murder Krauss or Natsuhi!
No one shot through the window!

Hahaha I'll enjoy seeing you struggle through this one.

Last edited at 18/09/07(Fri)17:32:20
>> No. 21250 edit
File 153261805541.png - (184.07KB , 500x600 , But_b23_komaru2.png )
21250
>>21249

Should I have gone with the simpler theory then?

Natsuhi killed Krauss then commited suicide.

The most simple explanation for a closed room murder may just be the correct one.
>> No. 21251 edit
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21251
>>21250
Natsuhi didn't commit suicide!
>> No. 21252 edit
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21252
>>21251

But she did kill Krauss, no? Maybe they had a fight and she died from her wounds after locking the door from the inside.

Though I really think I'm grasping at straws here. I underestimated you. I shouldn't have.
>> No. 21253 edit
File 15363678824.png - (701.13KB , 1187x1064 , eva 14 1.png )
21253
>>21252
Neither Natsuhi or Krauss had any wounds...
Because Natsuhi and Krauss drowned
>> No. 21254 edit
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21254
Wha-? Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat? They drowned? How? How did that even happen? And where? How? When? Where? How? What??????????
>> No. 21255 edit
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21255
>>21254

They were obstacles in the revival of the Golden Witch!

So I drowned them. Drowned them in an ocean not water but jelly! They choked and begged me for mercy, but what mercy does predator offer it's prey?

How could they have drowned if not for my magic? It's impossible! Why don't you just give up!? Ahahah!

Last edited at 18/09/07(Fri)18:08:18
>> No. 21256 edit
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21256
>>21255
Hideyoshi killed Natsuhi and Krauss. They drowned on snow. The window was locked from outside since it was broken.
>> No. 21257 edit
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21257
>>21256
Hideyoshi didn't kill Natsuhi or Krauus
Natsuhi and Krauss didn't drown on snow
At the time of Krauss and Natsuhi's death, the window wasn't broken.
Nor did the culprit break the window in an effort to escape!
>> No. 21258 edit
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21258
>>21257
Kinzo did then, he is missing and alive after all. They were knocked out and drowned in a bathtub or sink. The room was constructed after, hence the window still being intact during their deaths.

Last edited at 18/09/07(Fri)18:48:46
>> No. 21259 edit
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21259
>>21258
Kinzo did not kill Natsuhi and Krauss
Natsuhi and Krauss were conscious before and whilst they were drowning, up until the lack of oxygen made them pass out
Natsuhi died in her room! Krauss died right outside it! Their bodies were not moved after they died!

Last edited at 18/09/07(Fri)18:56:22
>> No. 21260 edit
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21260
>>21259
Oh? Now this is getting weird.

Secondary drowning. Natsuhi and Krauss fell by accident or were forced underwater. Either way they passed out and someone put the bodies where they were found. Only then did they died from the lack of oxygen.

Last edited at 18/09/07(Fri)19:22:55
>> No. 21262 edit
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21262
>>21260
Natsuhi and Krauss started to drown exactly where they were found, and finished drowning exactly where they were found, and never left those spots the entire time!
Natsuhi and Krauss's bodies weren't moved! Whether Alive or Dead, Conscious or Unconscious, Natsuhi and Krauss's bodies were not moved by anyone else!
Natsuhi and Krauss weren't forced underwater
>> No. 21264 edit
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21264
>>21262

Could it be your choice of words again? You said that Eva, Hideyoshi and Kinzo did not 'kill' Krauss or Natsuhi, but that Rosa did not 'murder' them.
>> No. 21265 edit
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21265
>>21264
Just a little red herring

Not that these deaths needed one, hehehe
Rosa did not kill Natsuhi and Krauss
>> No. 21266 edit
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21266
>>21265
The mansion/room was flooded and the window broke from the water.

If not can we get a definition for what it means to drowned?
>> No. 21267 edit
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21267
>>21266
The mansion didn't flood with water
Drowning is defined as dying from lungs filled with fluid preventing acquisition of oxygen thus causing death
>> No. 21268 edit
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21268
>>21267
Of course, only the lungs.

Natsuhi and Krauss got way too drunk and eventually they threw up and choked on their own vomit.

Similarly, They drank something that just happened to go down the wrong pipe and choked to death by accident.

Or, probably the easiest answer, Natsuhi and Krauss were wounded in a different way, but only died from drowning on their own bodily fluids.
>> No. 21269 edit
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21269
>>21268
Natsuhi and Krauss didn't choke on vomit
nor did they die from drinking something... infact No fluid passed their lips at all
Natsuhi and Krauss had no wounds

I cannot deny that they didn't drown on bodily fluids... I mean, surely with any amount of fluid in the lungs, at least some of it would be bodily fluids, right? there's no way I can deny it.

Last edited at 18/09/08(Sat)16:52:18
>> No. 21270 edit
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>>21269
So in other words if they drowned on their bodily fluids without any wounds it would be fine.

They had an allergic reaction or contracted something like pneumonia. Either way this could cause their lungs to be filled and thus drowned by definition.
>> No. 21271 edit
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>>21270
Neither of them had an allergic reaction or pneumonia. Neither of them had any pre-existing condition of the lungs!
I wonder where Jessica gets it from?
>> No. 21272 edit
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>>21271

What if their lungs filled with bodily fluids because they choked on something solid? Like, say, an areca nut? Would that count as 'drowning'?

Last edited at 18/09/09(Sun)19:47:40
>> No. 21273 edit
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>>21272

If it was the fluid preventing respiration then yes...

Although

No solid substance passed their lips either
Nor did any fluid or solid go up their noses

Last edited at 18/09/10(Mon)04:54:05
>> No. 21274 edit
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>>21273

Natsuhi and Krauss were exposed to some form of deadly gas. This gas damaged their lungs and caused them to fill with fluid, causing asphyxiation, or 'drowning.' Some possible examples would be nitrogen dioxide, or maybe phosgene. At any rate, they were exposed in Natsuhi's room. Krauss managed to stumble out, but Natsuhi knocked the door shut on her own run out. They then both died.

The window was broken to allow the gas to vent out in the subsequent hours.

The door was not actually locked when George went to open it.


How's that, witch?
>> No. 21276 edit
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>>21274
Ah- erm, Bravo! Natsuhi and Krauss both died due to exposure to such a gas

Although
Krauss's death was not an accident
The door truly was locked when Battler's group got there

Last edited at 18/09/11(Tue)03:36:49
>> No. 21277 edit
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21277
Probably also a good point to introduce the next twilight.

After leaving Natsuhi's room Battler's group goes to Kinzo's study.
Before knocking on the door, Kinzo, with his mouth slightly bleeding, emerges from the room! He laughs maniacally before asking how the ritual is progressing. He then says he doesn't want to know, calls everyone a load of blasted incompetent fools and storms off
Battler's group stand dumbstruck for about a minute, and then go down the stairs where Kinzo went.

Heh, I wouldn't put it past Grandpa

At the bottom of the stairs Battler's group sees Kinzo kneeling in closely front of the portrait of Beatrice. Shouting "WHY BEATRICE, WHY MUST MY LOVE GO UNREQUITED. WHY HAS THIS DEVIL'S ROULETTE CHOSEN ME! OH DESIRE!" before vomiting profuse amounts of blood from the mouth and dying.
Battler screams before eating his final Master Key. Maria begins to laugh like a witch creeping everyone out, especially Battler.
Battler runs to the Kitchen followed by Kyrie. There he eats a couple of teaspoons and an assortment of Napkins, as well as a potted plant.

Oh and for clarity's sake
Before Battler and Kyrie went to the kitchen, "Battler's group" consisted of Battler, George, Rudolf, Kyrie, Eva, Jessica and Maria

Last edited at 18/09/11(Tue)03:56:20
>> No. 21279 edit
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>>21277

It's a well known fact that Battler takes after Kinzo in a lot of ways.Kinzo, just like his grandson, has an impulsive need to eat cutlery and other such small objects. While eating a knife, he was somewhat careless and the knife cut the inside of his oesophagus. That's why he was bleeding from the mouth. Then, while he was yelling like a maniac, the knife also cut the inside of his stomach. That's why he vomited blood.

This is the truth! Kinzo died eating a knife!

Alternatively, he was poisoned. But that's booooring.

Last edited at 18/09/11(Tue)04:56:30
>> No. 21280 edit
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>>21279
Kinzo does indeed have an impulsive need to eat small inedible objects.
Kinzo was poisoned

Although

He wasn't bleeding from the mouth due to a ripped oesophagus

I poisoned him, I appeared right before him and spat poison from my vile tongue into his mouth using black magic.
>> No. 21281 edit
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>>21280

Wait, wait- he does? Haha, and here I thought that was funny so I said it on a whim! It would have been even funnier if he actually died from that though.

So, you admit to having a vile, venomous tongue? Even more proof you're just Eva.

Okay, enough chit-chat! Kinzo was bleeding because, just like his idiot grandson, this idiot chipped his tooth on whatever he was eating. He was poisoned by Eva, who is eager to succeed him immediately!
>> No. 21282 edit
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>>21281
Hehehe

Eva did not kill Kinzo

So how can I be Eva? I'm the black witch! Ahaha!

Last edited at 18/09/11(Tue)05:25:14
>> No. 21283 edit
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>>21282

Does food poisoning count? Maybe he died because of all the inedible things he ate.
>> No. 21284 edit
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>>21283
Nope.

Dying due to eating mundane inanimate objects counts as being killed by those objects and not being as poisoned.

Last edited at 18/09/11(Tue)05:49:52
>> No. 21285 edit
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>>21284

Yes, just as I expected. Better to get that out of the way first though.

He was poisoned by someone who knew of his condition. That certain someone put poison in the objects Kinzo would eat.
>> No. 21286 edit
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>>21285

The culprit didn't know of Kinzo's condition.
>> No. 21288 edit
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>>21286

Kinzo poisoned himself by ingesting a poisonous substance (say, some form of bathroom cleaner since he probably wanted to check his chipped tooth). Both he and Battler's conditions are completely subconscious, and no one dared to tell Kinzo about his.

Oh, and the potted plant Battler ate was tiny, compared to many potted plants.
>> No. 21289 edit
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>>21288

Kinzo was murdered! His death was not an accident!

I figured the potted plant is like one of those small ones you'd had in a windowsill so I guess that blue is valid.
>> No. 21292 edit
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>>21289

Very well then. If the culprit didn't know of Kinzo's condition, they could probably not have trusted him to eat something laid out to be poison. Still, there's plenty of things that Kinzo could be expected to do...

The poison was placed near, on, or behind the portrait of Beatrice. When touched or inhaled, it kills. For extra points, the culprit could have made a pressure-sensitive mechanism to release the poison, triggered by Kinzo's knees hitting the floor just in front of the portrait.
>> No. 21293 edit
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>>21292

Yes. There was a layer of poison applied to the painting.

But you still don't know who put it there!

Last edited at 18/09/15(Sat)02:22:15
>> No. 21295 edit
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>>21293

Don't tell me it was Genji.
>> No. 21296 edit
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>>21295
Hahahaha! What an insane idea.


Genji died before the poison was placed on the painting.

So it couldn't have been him.
>> No. 21297 edit
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>>21296

So it was recent, then? Or maybe not so much.

Wait, are we talking about the portrait in the hall? I assumed the portrait with the poison was the one in his study.

Last edited at 18/09/15(Sat)10:46:28
>> No. 21298 edit
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>>21297

Ahahaha yes, that's interesting. There's two portraits isn't there? And yet neither the blue or the red specify which portrait.

Although
Kinzo has been in his study for the entire game so far.
Kinzo didn't poison the portrait himself.

Do you understand which portrait now?
>> No. 21299 edit
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>>21296

Here we go, witch:

Eva solved the riddle of the epitaph, and as such gained control of the servants, and became Beatrice (which allowed her to control Maria). She ordered the servants to kill themselves, and to hide the gun using the pulley method, so that she could retrieve it later. She also got Genji's assistance prior to that to unlock Natsuhi's room, so that she could place the gas device inside.

After the deaths in the VIP room were discovered, she secreted the gun out from the hiding place Genji had gotten it.

Around that time, Krauss and Natsuhi entered her room. Eva did not know for certain that they would be the first to enter, so that does not count as 'murdering them' specifically. In a way, they died by accident. Natsuhi pushed Krauss out in an effort to save him and locked the door so he couldn't get back in. She then ran to the window and smashed it to ventilate the room. However, she died before making it back to the door. Krauss died while trying to get back in to save his wife.

Eva asked Rosa to meet by the tree. She shot her, placed the stake, and walked backwards to cover her tracks.

She was in the parlor with Maria when Hideyoshi discovered them. They got into an argument, the gun went off (world's quietest gun), and he died. Maria went to get the stake to cover up the death and the parlor room key. They exited and locked the door.

Around here is where Eva applied poison to the painting in the hall, knowing that soon Kinzo would come out, and would be the only one reasonably likely to touch the painting.

>> No. 21301 edit
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>>21299

Good! Very good!

But not quite right.

Eva didn't order the deaths of the servants.
Eva didn't place the gas device, nor did she or any of the servants lock or unlock the door.
Krauss's death wasn't an accident. It was murder.
Eva didn't kill Kinzo. She didn't apply the poison to the painting.

Furthermore

If someone intends to kill someone else, but doesn't care who, the intent to kill is all that matters. It doesn't matter that they don't know their target and it still counts as murder.


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